Territory Control idea - Feedback wanted

Should territory owners be able to blacklist whole guilds and Alert Towers reporting them?

  • Yes

    Votes: 60 76.9%
  • No

    Votes: 18 23.1%

  • Total voters
    78

Ichorous

The Argent Speedster
It has been awhile away for me, and my opinion might be unwanted or ill-informed. I don't think the valuable resources are distributed evenly enough for this change to result in interesting conflict. Is there any regional trade good that is comparable in value to the master alloys?


In all the time I played, the guild with control of the northeastern region was the most difficult to overpower. I believe this is because, apart from having fewer geograpical directions to defend against, a guild with the greater nat and the blast furnace controls the flow of Cronite and Oghmium. I imagine that recent changes allowing TC guilds to tax static city vendors also provide the northeastern guild with passive monetary income from both MK and GK, providing additional flows of cash wealth.

Is there any other geographic region as valuable as GK? I think not. Yet, when was the last time the GK keep was taken by force? I am concerned that this proposed change would make it even easier for the northeastern guild to defend its lands while amassing disproportionate amounts of wealth.

I could get behind a change like this if not for this geographical concentration of strategic value.
 
Thread starter #62

Herius

Quality Assurance Lead
Could we set taxes on towns inside the radius to benefit our guild off of all the players that pass through , further creating a sense of conflict and conquest due to the extra money that could be made simply from owning a town ?

This would be far more effective to making territory control a popular and fun thing than just simply being able to blacklist people (sounds to me of guard aids).
That's already implemented, a guild controlling a NPC town can set taxes on the vendors.
 
That's already implemented, a guild controlling a NPC town can set taxes on the vendors.
In Its current form it’s negligible and I think that’s why people don’t fight over control of towns as often as they should , maybe we could really beef up amount of gold received even if people aren’t using vendors but just -occupying- the city ?
 

Ichorous

The Argent Speedster
In Its current form it’s negligible and I think that’s why people don’t fight over control of towns as often as they should , maybe we could really beef up amount of gold received even if people aren’t using vendors but just -occupying- the city ?
Wait, why is it negligible? Isn't it a function of trade traffic and the tax rate? What is the maximum tax rate a controlling guild can set?
 

Keurk

Senior Member
a good way to solve the instant timers kick,invite, etc is to add some form of physical registration ingame. Like the people have to go to the guildhouse, or a magistrate, to actually join or leave the guild, with lets say a timer like with factions joining/Leaving. i dont see all thoses system(faction, blacklist guild, wardecs, etc) properly working or being interesting enought if players bypasses suchs system by major flaws in the invite mechanic design
 
Perhaps you could explain a bit more about the WHY. I wonder what meaning you guys see derived by this. I see control, power, I don't really see the meaning. I'm curious.
Exacly, these "features" as for -territory control- without an actual context, correlation and backing up from meaningfull mechanics is nothing.

Territory control per se could be a more complex texture of mechanics that serve more organic, interesting and challenging escenarios rather than the already conventional walling off content.

Its interesting how after this long time a revamp of the flagging system is comming along, finally. I believe local grey function for territory control might be a partial* solution to the primitive murdercount system MO has yet i must say i can see how this without proper balance can become any solo player, new player or small guilds nightmare. Thanks to the current MC system a local grey benefit from TC might just create a severe disadvantage to anyone that doesn't control the territory.

Appropiate it would be to develop a set of mechanics that balance and give purpose to these changes. I SV going to focus on player interaction to relay these control mechanics? Basically the self sustainability of guilds prevent mayor scale diplomacy strategies unless its a server war.
 
Exacly, these "features" as for -territory control- without an actual context, correlation and backing up from meaningfull mechanics is nothing.

Territory control per se could be a more complex texture of mechanics that serve more organic, interesting and challenging escenarios rather than the already conventional walling off content.

Its interesting how after this long time a revamp of the flagging system is comming along, finally. I believe local grey function for territory control might be a partial* solution to the primitive murdercount system MO has yet i must say i can see how this without proper balance can become any solo player, new player or small guilds nightmare. Thanks to the current MC system a local grey benefit from TC might just create a severe disadvantage to anyone that doesn't control the territory.

Appropiate it would be to develop a set of mechanics that balance and give purpose to these changes. I SV going to focus on player interaction to relay these control mechanics? Basically the self sustainability of guilds prevent mayor scale diplomacy strategies unless its a server war.
Good points. The severe disadvantage may lead to a consolidation of smaller guilds. Which would probably be a good thing overall, since all heathen guilds are basically the same anyway.

Also, whitelisting should be a thing.
 
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have you considered an inversion? make all lands outside of towns local gray territory. Have a whitelist instead where controlling guilds can give blue flag status to players they have vetted. guild members and any alliance guild members would be blue flagged by default in the sphere of influence.

also, why have any limitations on the size of the list?

-barcode
 

Ichorous

The Argent Speedster
have you considered an inversion? make all lands outside of towns local gray territory. Have a whitelist instead where controlling guilds can give blue flag status to players they have vetted. guild members and any alliance guild members would be blue flagged by default in the sphere of influence.
-barcode
Dude, this is neat. I have a lot of interesting ideas for a system like that.
 
Is there any regional trade good that is comparable in value to the master alloys?

Is there any other geographic region as valuable as GK? I think not. Yet, when was the last time the GK keep was taken by force? I am concerned that this proposed change would make it even easier for the northeastern guild to defend its lands while amassing disproportionate amounts of wealth.
.
Well the jungle has cosmoid, lots of pansar and platescales, and animal mag. And infinite calx (too bad skade is kinda bad lol), and good alchemy mats. But I will agree that GK is still better overall.

I think the problem is the G Nat is just too op (vs normal nat). Like I've considered trying to make cron, but normal nat is just too horrible. Normal furnace you can still make steel easily. And tung you just fabricula waterstone. but cron and stuff theres just no good way. Even if I mine any of the gabore / tephra in the tind area, it doesnt matter because using the normal nat murders the galb. You can furnace the galb for lupium to ruin it less but that doesnt help to make cron, which you then get pathetic amounts from without g nat for almine.

And tephra is way better than gabore. But at least pleb amounts of gabore and maybe tephra around the world + normal nat buff would make making cron and stuff at least more viable without being up north.

have you considered an inversion? make all lands outside of towns local gray territory. Have a whitelist instead where controlling guilds can give blue flag status to players they have vetted. guild members and any alliance guild members would be blue flagged by default in the sphere of influence.

also, why have any limitations on the size of the list?

-barcode
This would be dope. Although some areas may still want to be blue. Like around tind. Gotta give the nubs and carebears at least a little love. Would also promote people not pvping in nub areas, which is good. Nubs getting slaughtered by the "pvpers" looking for pvp doesnt help the game. Like reds in tind gy just killing nubs trying to kill walkers. I've done it too but it def doesnt help the game out lol. And what we really need is more pop, the game would be a lot more fun even with the current systems if we had more players.
 

Keurk

Senior Member
Well the jungle has cosmoid, lots of pansar and platescales, and animal mag. And infinite calx (too bad skade is kinda bad lol), and good alchemy mats. But I will agree that GK is still better overall.

I think the problem is the G Nat is just too op (vs normal nat). Like I've considered trying to make cron, but normal nat is just too horrible. Normal furnace you can still make steel easily. And tung you just fabricula waterstone. but cron and stuff theres just no good way. Even if I mine any of the gabore / tephra in the tind area, it doesnt matter because using the normal nat murders the galb. You can furnace the galb for lupium to ruin it less but that doesnt help to make cron, which you then get pathetic amounts from without g nat for almine.

And tephra is way better than gabore. But at least pleb amounts of gabore and maybe tephra around the world + normal nat buff would make making cron and stuff at least more viable without being up north.


This would be dope. Although some areas may still want to be blue. Like around tind. Gotta give the nubs and carebears at least a little love. Would also promote people not pvping in nub areas, which is good. Nubs getting slaughtered by the "pvpers" looking for pvp doesnt help the game. Like reds in tind gy just killing nubs trying to kill walkers. I've done it too but it def doesnt help the game out lol. And what we really need is more pop, the game would be a lot more fun even with the current systems if we had more players.
a rare lootable / buyable portable Gnat workbenches you could get FAR from the north of myrland could help : people would definitly see the use of such workbench, try to get it, and it would also open for gank scenario with people processing extreme valuable ores somewhere else than at Gnat.
It have to be balanced, not possible to buy a lot of thoses. Steintroll cave idea in mind, what about some mobs giving you a standing, but everytime you buy the portable workbenche your standing decrease,like prominence spent points. So you would need to farm activly the mobs if you want to have another workbenche, so people could have pvp on the spot while farming mobs for this "standing"
 
This would be dope. Although some areas may still want to be blue. Like around tind. Gotta give the nubs and carebears at least a little love. Would also promote people not pvping in nub areas, which is good. Nubs getting slaughtered by the "pvpers" looking for pvp doesnt help the game. Like reds in tind gy just killing nubs trying to kill walkers. I've done it too but it def doesnt help the game out lol. And what we really need is more pop, the game would be a lot more fun even with the current systems if we had more players.
with newbie island coming, new players should have an easier time starting out at any of the existing npc towns. Tind is still probably the better choice for proper nubs but at least they will be spread out a bit.

-barcode
 
I like the local grey, that's great. But alert towers automatically scouting just makes it impossible for an attacker to use the element of surprise without going around the system and taking PvP characters out of their guild which is exactly what happened when wardecs used to ping players. Mortal Online is so amazing beause theres no map showing your enemies and you can take your group through a less-traveled path and attack an enemy by surprising them, this just ruins that.


Alert towers scouting players ruins any stealth element of the game.


All this does is favor the defending side tremendously which is the absolute last thing sieging needs right now.

How are people commenting on this claiming that it will promote any kind of pvp. blacklisting people and turning them grey probably would and there would be a lot less murdercounts in legitimate PvP, thats awesome.

But add in towers scouting people and all that PvP goes straight down the drain.

in my opinion @Herius has failed in creating this poll as a yes/no answer for a system that is basically 2 different part. Most people love the idea of having your enemies turn grey thats great, the tower pinging is a different system entirely and should NOT be brought back because it was terrible.

Again, let me TL;DR for people to understand this:

Turning enemies in your territory grey - great idea, this is good.

Towers scouting people and removing any stealth element from the game - this is stupid, don't bring this back.

the poll doesn't allow for this to be communicated. plz do better in the future.
 
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I like the local grey, that's great. But alert towers automatically scouting just makes it impossible for an attacker to use the element of surprise without going around the system and taking PvP characters out of their guild which is exactly what happened when wardecs used to ping players. Mortal Online is so amazing beause theres no map showing your enemies and you can take your group through a less-traveled path and attack an enemy by surprising them, this just ruins that.


Alert towers scouting players ruins any stealth element of the game.


All this does is favor the defending side tremendously which is the absolute last thing sieging needs right now.

How are people commenting on this claiming that it will promote any kind of pvp. blacklisting people and turning them grey probably would and there would be a lot less murdercounts in legitimate PvP, thats awesome.

But add in towers scouting people and all that PvP goes straight down the drain.

in my opinion @Herius has failed in creating this poll as a yes/no answer for a system that is basically 2 different part. Most people love the idea of having your enemies turn grey thats great, the tower pinging is a different system entirely and should NOT be brought back because it was terrible.

Again, let me TL;DR for people to understand this:

Turning enemies in your territory grey - great idea, this is good.

Towers scouting people and removing any stealth element from the game - this is stupid, don't bring this back.

the poll doesn't allow for this to be communicated. plz do better in the future.
A stealth element is good, it's a good point to bring up. Perhaps there is some way to enable more interaction with alert towers and guards in general. Attacking alert towers killing guards, disabling signaling for awhile without having to blow everything up. My guess, as we don't typically get much direct communication on intentions from SV these days, is that this is something small to change that might have a big impact. With a significant change to the way players interact with TC, Guards, Alert towers, etc., it could be a step in a good direction. Would be cool if Herius and Seb played the game, or communicated more clearly with those that still do.
 
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I like the local grey, that's great. But alert towers automatically scouting just makes it impossible for an attacker to use the element of surprise without going around the system and taking PvP characters out of their guild which is exactly what happened when wardecs used to ping players. Mortal Online is so amazing beause theres no map showing your enemies and you can take your group through a less-traveled path and attack an enemy by surprising them, this just ruins that.


Alert towers scouting players ruins any stealth element of the game.


All this does is favor the defending side tremendously which is the absolute last thing sieging needs right now.

How are people commenting on this claiming that it will promote any kind of pvp. blacklisting people and turning them grey probably would and there would be a lot less murdercounts in legitimate PvP, thats awesome.

But add in towers scouting people and all that PvP goes straight down the drain.

in my opinion @Herius has failed in creating this poll as a yes/no answer for a system that is basically 2 different part. Most people love the idea of having your enemies turn grey thats great, the tower pinging is a different system entirely and should NOT be brought back because it was terrible.

Again, let me TL;DR for people to understand this:

Turning enemies in your territory grey - great idea, this is good.

Towers scouting people and removing any stealth element from the game - this is stupid, don't bring this back.

the poll doesn't allow for this to be communicated. plz do better in the future.
I know all your keeps haven't lasted that long but for actual keep owners ninja sieging is a large problem. You can build a trebuchet and destroy a tower quicker than an alert tower can ping it. You can build a battering ram and battering ram into a tower quicker than anyone could possibly hope to respond.
 

Speznat

Senior Member
I like the idea :)
please SV do it.

also please give mor emeaning to tc and keep owning than people will start to build usable stuff again.
the lands look so barren and unpopulated noone like to waste money on stuff that have no use.
 
I know all your keeps haven't lasted that long but for actual keep owners ninja sieging is a large problem. You can build a trebuchet and destroy a tower quicker than an alert tower can ping it. You can build a battering ram and battering ram into a tower quicker than anyone could possibly hope to respond.
Seems like you've got some conflicting statements in here..... ?

TC that is defended with guards can't be sieged, TC that isn't guarded gets sieged. It's pretty boring.

You guys can't take more than a single wall off tofu because guards are so aids. Lul. If these changes were to go through? You wouldn't even be able to do that. People would be sitting on the walls with fire arrows before you even place a mang.

An alert tower already alerts you to a siege weapon immediately, telling you its exact location before it is even finished building. Why would you need any more than this to defend against "ninja sieges" ?
 
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Seems like you've got some conflicting statements in here..... ?

TC that is defended with guards can't be sieged, TC that isn't guarded gets sieged. It's pretty boring.

You guys can't take more than a single wall off tofu because guards are so aids. Lul. If these changes were to go through? You wouldn't even be able to do that. People would be sitting on the walls with fire arrows before you even place a mang.

An alert tower already alerts you to a siege weapon immediately, telling you its exact location before it is even finished building. Why would you need any more than this to defend against "ninja sieges" ?
What is conflicting?
Your keep had guards.
Tofu wouldn't be able to blacklist, they dont have a keep.
Alert towers ping every 5 minutes, you can build a siege weapon way under 5 minutes with scraps, especially if you have multiple engineers.
 
What is conflicting?
Your keep had guards.
Tofu wouldn't be able to blacklist, they dont have a keep.
Alert towers ping every 5 minutes, you can build a siege weapon way under 5 minutes with scraps, especially if you have multiple engineers.
"guards"

4 guards.

you aren't being very genuine here, havnt you got tc towers with more than that.

it wasnt my keep btw it was pyres.

I think we're getting a little off topic.
 
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MolagAmur

Well-Known Member
a good way to solve the instant timers kick,invite, etc is to add some form of physical registration ingame. Like the people have to go to the guildhouse, or a magistrate, to actually join or leave the guild, with lets say a timer like with factions joining/Leaving. i dont see all thoses system(faction, blacklist guild, wardecs, etc) properly working or being interesting enought if players bypasses suchs system by major flaws in the invite mechanic design
They could do like Black Desert with the contract and payouts. That would be interesting.
 
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